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Scripting News -- February 1998

Saturday, February 28, 1998

Take a trip down memory lane on Mail Starting 2/27/98. To the young kids reading Scripting News, when you get to be an old fart like I am, you'll probably like telling war stories too.

Sneak preview: Classified Ads for Frontier 5. We're still shaking out bugs serverside on Windows, but the bugs aren't in the ClassAds software. It should work fine on the Mac. This is what groupware looks like in the Frontier environment.

A new built-in verb: tcp.sendMail.

In Frontier 5, we added a feature called "this" that allows you to build powerful packages of code and data in Frontier's object database.

The new Frontier 5 menus and icons site has lots of important info.

Macrobyte: The SiteLiner suite generates truly hierarchic, outline-based navigation links.

ObjectWatch covers COM and DCOM. Interesting!

Philadelphia Daily News: Henny Youngman Remembered. He was the king of self-deprecation. "I was so ugly when I was born, the doctor slapped my mother." At his funeral, the rabbi said "God take Henny, please."

SF Chronicle: On his 91st birthday Youngman summoned reporters to a New York restaurant to read his last will and testament. "To my nephew Irving, who keeps asking me to mention him in my will," the comedian read aloud. "Hello, Irving." He was corny, but he made us laugh!

Friday, February 27, 1998

DaveNet: RPC over HTTP via XML.

Mail Starting 2/27/98.

SF Chron: Clinton draws high-tech cheers, local jeers.

Aloha! Keola Donaghy is using Frontier to make serving RealAudio content easier.

Patrick Gaumond says that www.asia.microsoft.com is four times faster than www.microsoft.com.

Wired: Scientists discover anti-gravity?

Betty is back! Please reload this page several times to help us test the server. We fixed a major bug last night, and believe it should now be able to sustain a reasonable load. Thanks for your help testing this.

Microsoft: Writing ISAPI Filters and Script Interpreters. Thanks! This is exactly what we needed.

Apple discontinues Newton OS. Instead of seeing this as a glass-half-empty thing, let's look on the bright side. Frontier could do much of what the Newton OS could do. Their "soup" was a lot like our object database. Their programming language was a lot like ours. But our stuff built on the Mac OS, theirs didn't. We zigged where Apple zagged, and our paths met up.

I've gotten a bunch of mail on the Newton bit above and I want to clarify. I've always believed a small form factor Mac OS machine would be great. Newton was in the way. Now, many years later, technology has moved forward and a hand-held Mac OS machine makes even more sense. If they want Newton-like functionality, we have a lot of it already built in Frontier.

Thursday, February 26, 1998

Today I released the full source code for the Scripting News website. All my secrets come out! It you're learning Frontier or want to learn more about Frontier, go get the source code to this very programmed website.

The March issue of Byte is all about XML.

Bob Bierman has a question for people who know Apache: 'In writing a module (DLL) for Apache under Windows NT, how do you specify in the module and or handler-rec that you are interested only in files of a certain extension (such as .fcgi)?' If you know the answer, please send email to bierman@scripting.com. We want to get Frontier working with Apache asap, we're also now working on the IIS connection.

A cultural language note. A writer on one of our lists says "I think it is very usable script at this point." Where I come from, the correct grammar would be "I think it is a very usable script at this point." I notice more and more people speaking this way. Where did this way of speaking of script (er scripts) come from?

Mac OS Rumors says Apple is going to be more developer-friendly, especially with tool makers. If you're at Apple and can confirm this, please me email. We want the Mac platform to be stronger. It's good for our business if it is.

A letter to the editor from MacWEEK about whether or not Frontier is the first cross-platform scripting environment from Scott Raney of MetaCard.

Techweb: Novell establishes a $50 Million Java fund.

News.com: Javagator on back burner.

MacWEEK: Autotools batch processes Quark files.

Wednesday, February 25, 1998

DaveNet: The Two-Way Trip.

I've decided to try something new. When an interesting question comes up on the Frontier-newbies list or the Frontier-webmaster list, and if the question can be answered by building a small site, I'm going to build the site on my LAN and put it up as a fat page for other people to see. Here's the first example site.

Marimba: Castanet 2.1 public beta.

CNN: Streisand too sick to sing on Grammys. Me too!

Chris Wertman is building a graphic configuration program for Apache/Win.

Tuesday, February 24, 1998

We're getting very close with the COM/DLL interface between Apache and Frontier on Windows. A few more mysteries to solve and then we'll be ready to release. We'll be releasing C++ source code for the connectors, so others can do the glue to connect with other Windows-based web servers. After that we start digging on the client side of COM for Frontier 5.

Gavin Eadie's SMTP server moves forward.

Webmonkey reviews wizzy HTML editors.

Vignette CEO Ross Garber responds on Mail Starting 2/23/98.

I got a huge dose of the flu last night, so it's going to be a light day on Scripting News.

Monday, February 23, 1998

DaveNet: Vignette and Scripting News.

Netscape opens www.mozilla.org to organize work done with the free source code for their browser. The code is slated to be released on March 31.

Every Monday a hot site on Thea's Galleria.

Mail Starting 2/23/98.

Here's the XML source for today's Scripting News. You may have to View Source to see the tags.

12/27/97: Scripting News in XML.

Gavin Eadie is testing a SMTP server running in Frontier. He's an experienced programmer but a Frontier newbie. If you have experience, please try this out and help him get it working. It would be really great to get a mail server running in Frontier!

Sunday, February 22, 1998

DaveNet: XML Databases.

The new DocServer site for Frontier 5 is ready. Each built-in verb in Frontier gets its own page. It's like the man page convention in Unix, thru a web interface.

The name of the DocServer site comes from an app that's been with us since 1992 called (of course) DocServer. It's a hybrid of a database, a browser and a scripting interface. Pretty cool stuff. Very futuristic for 1992. However, we didn't port DocServer to Windows, we're moving away from the app, and towards HTML rendering of verb pages.

John Delacour, a prolific Frontier developer, has been working on the Verbi suite for Frontier 5. It provides the same info as the website, without a net connection, all running inside Frontier, Mac or Windows. Lots of people use Verbi and highly recommend it.

The original author of the DocServer text is Dan Shafer, who now is a famous industry pundit!

Wes Felter, a future superstar (he's 19) is working on DocServer for us now.

Many of Frontier's verbs are cross-platform, including the string, file, outline, and threading verbs. These are just examples, if you want, apps built in Frontier can run equally well on Windows or Macs.

You can download a copy of the DocServer app and the database for the Frontier 4 verb set. Mac only.

What happened at macfaq.com?

Is it a love triangle? The NY Times reports on the return of H. Ross to Perot Systems. The guy he booted out is Jim Cannavino, who is rumored to be Apple's new CEO. He would work for Steve Jobs, or work with Steve Jobs, or would replace Steve Jobs. Now, remember that Perot used to be Jobs's partner at NeXT. Does it make your head spin?

Dino Morelli is working on getting data from Frontier's object database into Java.

Maybe Ask Jeeves is what we need? It's interesting. They use human beings to create their index.

SJ Merc: An argument in favor of leaving, now.



Saturday, February 21, 1998

MacFair 98 needs help from Frontier programmers. Let's pitch in!

Another storm is coming thru, trees are falling, bridges are getting washed out, the creeks look like the Colorado River, but the power is on and the servers are up. Still praying!

Jeremie Miller has an XML parser in a web page.

Friday, February 20, 1998

Le Big News! Si vous parlez francais et Frontier, you'll want to check this out.

Philip Martin, one of the moderators of the Frontier-en-Francais list, has a Frontier tips page, in English. Ayons l'amusement!

A group forms to bring Netscape's browser to Rhapsody.

According to Wired, there's a connection between the Palm Pilot and the Mac development communities. I didn't know that.

We're looking at Microsoft's HTML Help facility. Here's a PC Magazine article.

Jesse Berst makes a boring but valid point. Push isn't dead. It just has a different name. Email. Right on! Zzzzz.

Lots of meetings in the last few days! Glad to get back to some programming and writing. The first new thing, I've converted the Guestbook CGI to run in Frontier 5.

Please help me burn it in. Sign the guestbook, or see who has signed it. Thanks!

Check this out, it's almost funny -- this may be the first guestbook app with an XML RPC interface.

Fat Page: Source for suites.guestbook.

News.com: How Microsoft misfired on components.

News.com is focusing on marketing slogans and missing that there's a technical revolution hidden inside Windows, a far-reaching architecture, called COM.

Unlike other buzzwords, COM has substance, a long history, but unfortunately has suffered from Microsoft's mishandling of the marketing job, and the industry's cynicism about Microsoft.

Interestingly, News.com got the story last August: Yes to COM, no to hype.

Thursday, February 19, 1998

Slate: Millionerds. Great stuff!

A friend from the Digital Storytelling Festival, Abbe Don, has asked for help in promoting her newly redesigned story site, Bubbe's Back Porch.

Fredric Paul on Builder.com: Web scripting gets no respect.

Brian Andresen of Technology Solutions is working on enabling Frontier for editing Java projects.

There's a lot of promise in Frontier as a Java development environment. It was a surprise, kind of a breakthrough in point of view. If you're interested, take a look and join the discussion on the Frontier-Java list.

Wednesday, February 18, 1998

InfoWorld: MSIE 5.0 to implement vector graphics.

Why is this important? See LineTo MoveTo, 6/24/97.

BrowserWatch discussion on vector graphics in web browsers.

Mail Starting 2/18/98.

MacWEEK: Quark buys Coris.

From Allaire's website, an analysis by Technologic Partners. They see Frontier as a potential threat, but as two small companies competing in a market that offers lots of chances to specialize, we want to work with Allaire.

Red Herring on keiretsu.

Kleiner-Perkins on keiretsu.

TechWeb: It's a great time to be a VC.

Tuesday, February 17, 1998

Two new sample CGIs on the Fat Pages site. The simplest CGI just says Hello World, and a simple form handler greets you with a name you enter into an HTML form.

Setting up a Frontier server: On Windows, and on a Mac. We need a single page that explains this

Chris Heilman did a fantastic Frontier at a Glance page.

News.com: NetObjects acquires scripting products.

Monday, February 16, 1998

It's Monday, so, another great site on Thea's Galleria. This week's site is done with BBEdit and Frontier.

Did you miss one of the Galleria sites? No problem. Thea's site has a page that points to all previously featured sites.

Fat Pages Site: Parse Mail Message Script. It gets all the non-interesting parts of a mail message out of your way.

Mac OS Rumors is predicting that Jim Cannavino will be named the new CEO of Apple. One of my first DaveNets was an open letter to Cannavino, then a top exec at IBM, urging them to get behind the Mac OS.

SJ Merc: A new storm is on the way.

Jeff Veen on WebMonkey: The foundations of web design.

Red Herring: ICE may unlock content markets?

We're having a two-day planning meeting so there won't be as much new stuff on scripting.com today and tomorrow.

Sunday, February 15, 1998

Fat Page logo

If you're new to Frontier, take a tour of the Fat Pages site. Lots of useful scripts, suites, agents, CGIs and macros for Mac and cross-platform. See the site outline for a full list.

The Incoming Objects Agent moves to the Fat Pages site and is improved with better error handling.

How David Drumheller discovered outlining software.

It's a follow up to a piece I did on 2/2/98.

The car isn't what's interesting about this page.

Wired report on Java developer James Gosling.

Upside: Diary of a startup.

SJ Merc: Too much venture capital in Silicon Valley?

Esther Dyson in the NY Times with a similar theme: Too many would-be investors and too few real companies.

Saturday, February 14, 1998

Big kiss! Happy Valentine's Day!

To all you lovers in InternetLand!

It's a great holiday!

The Fat Pages site has been reviewed and lots of the code adapted to work with 5.0.

We're working closely with Brian Andresen of Technology Solutions on the XMLization of Frontier. Today Brian released a test version of the odb2xml suite.

To illustrate Brian's work, here's what a Frontier outline looks like in XML.

We're now running Frontier 5/Mac on our main server.

Microsoft: A Kinder gentler intro to COM.

Friday, February 13, 1998

Le cours d'instruction de Web de la Frontier 5 a été traduit en français. Ayons l'amusement!

Fast Track: Frontier-based HTTP Client.

Mail Starting 2/13/98.

Here's a project we should do when Netscape releases the source. Let's add code to the browser to call, thru COM or AEs, to another process running on the same machine.

This is the key to building beautiful DHTML interfaces for Frontier. It would be cross-platform and totally up to the person building the app. People have been asking for this for years. Now we may be close to delivery.

Here's a discussion. If you're interested in this kind of stuff, lurk on the discussion on the Frontier-central list.

A writer from Microsoft says "IE can do this today. In fact IE 3 could do this." True, but Netscape can't. We're deliberately spreading out, hoping that when we move, Netscape moves with us. We're aren't anti-Microsoft, this is just what makes business sense for us.

Macrobyte: Prepress Autotools 1.0. Batch processes Quark XPress files, producing Postscript, and much more. A great publishing system, running in Frontier. Free 30-day trial.

I check my horoscope every Friday the 13th. Here's what it says today: "Dissension in the ranks. Instead of hushing things up, get colleagues to air grievances. They may discover their own solution." Interesting!

Read this before you propose: Marriage means less sex.

The next Amazon? American Science & Surplus. It's funny!

One of their hottest products: Mine Barricade Tape.

Wired: Bring on the Frankenbrowsers.

Do you speak Latin? What does this mean? Apertam in mentem inrepit sapientia. From Will Cate: "Not a literal translation, but essentially, 'Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.'"

Trying again: A Money Idea for Apple.

Break a leg! It's Friday the 13th. Have fun anyway!

Thursday, February 12, 1998

We're on the front page of CNET.COM!

"Perhaps the perfect cross-platform Web scripting solution."

The full review.

Thanks Dan! Thanks Cnet!

It was time to do a quick update of www.userland.com.

MacWEEK: Vignette StoryServer client ships for Mac.

Mark Guzdial's diary of work he did on collaborative systems in Frontier in 1997.

Here's a case where the software industry depends on Microsoft to solve a thorny problem.

On the other hand, sometimes Microsoft's size creates a major problem for the software industry.

Jakob Nielsen: The Reputation Manager. Look for the easter egg.

And old Frontier/Mac logo, circa 1996. It's funky!

When I upgraded to 5.0 on my Mac workstation, I forgot to re-install the SiteChanges app. Now the XML file is being updated every night, again.

InfoWorld: BeOS for Intel.

These guys really know how to sweat the pixels:

winamp picture

Got a Mac? Get MacAmp. Got X? Get X11Amp.

Here's the edited text of a series of messages I've been writing for the Frontier-work list, explaining to the core members of our community how to field questions from people who are new to Frontier.

Wednesday, February 11, 1998

DaveNet: Learning from Newbies.

Mail Starting 2/11/98.

Khare and Rifkin: A fine tutorial on XML.

December 1997: XML and Real-World XML.

This help system at Phoenix College may be the prototype of the learning center I'm looking for. Please, just observe, don't ask or answer questions. Real students and teachers are working here.

If you're interested in working with us as we wire up Frontier's object database, outliner and runtime to XML interfaces: first review our XML website, and then join the new Frontier-XML list.

CNN: ISO picks QuickTime as basis for MPEG-4 standard.

Here's a script that was requested on the Frontier-newbies list. I don't mind because I like to write scripts!

ABC News: Taking on the Browser Giants.

More NT server info on Mail Starting 2/10/98.

Tuesday, February 10, 1998

The Frontier 5 scripting tutorial is available for online browsing and download.

AltaVista's new free email website is built with Frontier. View source on the home page, scroll to the bottom, you'll see an empty fat page comment.

Just getting started with Frontier? I'm answering questions on the Frontier-newbies list. We're having fun! Come join us!

Got Flash? Here's a beautiful site.

Mail Starting 2/10/98.

We want to create a DLL module for Apache that calls Frontier via COM. Does anyone have sample code for an Apache DLL? Mail to bierman@scripting.com.

Introducing http://betty.userland.com/. A new Apache server running on Windows NT 4.0. It was a minor bear to configure. But it's working. Let's have fun!

We run WebSTAR on many of our servers It has a nice feature, a window that scrolls as hits come in. Is there anything like this for Apache on Windows? I'd like to be able to watch people crawl thru the site.

Comanche is a GNU project to build a graphic configuration front-end for Apache.

What are the best/easiest/cheapest mail servers that run on NT 4.0?

Apache comes with a collection of icons. Maybe we can do something interesting with these?

News.com: W3C makes XML a standard.

Meet the Frontier community, some very talented people and companies, investing alongside us in making Frontier a great cross-platform web scripting environment.

Seybold's Pete Dyson thinks Netscape's gamble will pay off. He believes that Apple and Sun should do the same with the Mac OS and Java.

AnchorDesk: IBM reorganizes around E-commerce.

HALO 2.0b10 is a general-purpose outline renderer, matching the tree-like structure of HTML and XML to the outline structure in Frontier. It is compatible with Frontier 4 and with Frontier 5 on both platforms.

Monday, February 09, 1998

Let's go to a Brazilian newsroom with Thea and Her Galleria. Every Monday, rain or shine!

More stuffff on Mail Starting 2/8/98.

BusinessWeek: Steve Jobs wants to transform Pixar into a filmmaker to match Disney.

I downloaded the compiled version of Apache for Windows and thought I'd give it a try. But when I double-click on Apache.exe, a black window briefly flashes on the screen and goes away. No web server. Bummer!

From Jeff Baker: "apache -i to install the service, then 'net start apache' to start it. Or, just apache -s to run it as a regular program. Some tinkering with the httpd.conf is also required, but it should be obvious after a quick scan through the file."

WebLoad is a HTTP pounder for Windows.

I asked Mason Hale, an early contributor in Frontier Internet development, to coach the new superstars on how to work with me. I did it publicly. Mason, as I was sure he would, has some advice to offer. Thanks!

Brian Kelly would like to be involved in starting and maintaining a Frontier Users Group in the New York/Tri-State area. Send email to bkelly@cloud9.net if you'd like to participate.

For people on the Frontier-work list, here's the future directions slide from the presentation I did in Palm Springs.

Wired: Yahoo tops list of 25 most busy sites.

InternetWorld reviews site management tools.

Reuters: Trial lawyers have more testosterone.

More testing! Bang on this CGI. Thanks!

Sunday, February 08, 1998

An incredible essay by Alan Ballew on Male Anger.

Eric Raymond responds to my first Cathedral and Bazaar piece.

SJ Merc: Java finds a home connecting different kinds of servers and databases.

NY Times: Apple profits down again. Gotcha!

Learning from Newbies is the road to success!

Two surveys: Buddies and User Groups. We've been having memory trouble with the new CGI server, so consider this a test run.

Mail Starting 2/8/98.

A list of the known bugs in the Frontier 5.0 app.

PGP 5.5 source code released. It would be great if someone could turn this into a DLL for Frontier 5.

Saturday, February 07, 1998

Competition is OK, but...

I have a suggestion how we could work together. If you want to do everything Frontier does on Linux, good luck! But if you want to put together an elegant web content system that you could build in a few months, check this out...

In early 1995 I did a project called AutoWeb. Here are the old 1995 docs for AutoWeb. With the benefit of hindsight, AutoWeb was a pretty simple idea and going in the right direction. I bet it would go over big on Unix in 1998.

A cornucopia of Linux software on Mail Starting 2/7/98.

Project Cool's http://www.devsearch.com/.

Friday, February 06, 1998

DaveNet: Linux.

Dan Gillmor in the SJ Merc on Be.

Docs: Setting up a Frontier 5 Server.

Sample code: Frontier-based HTTP Client.

CNN: Microsoft in court with TV Host.

Thea Partridge is working on docs for #directives. If you have experience working with Frontier's website framework, a careful review would be helpful at this time. Send comments to thea@scripting.com.

I'm testing a new server at 206.204.24.10:81.

It's a Dell Pentium system, 200Mhz, 64MB RAM, lots of disk space. Right now it's only running Frontier and MSIE 4. We'll probably bring up a commercial web server on this system not too far down the road and Frontier will just be a CGI engine, dynamic page renderer, and groupware database server.

The test for today is a revised version of the LetsHaveFun app. Please reload a few times, but don't pound it. Thanks!

The source code for LetsHaveFun is on my personal site.

SJ Merc: Cold calls uncover vulnerable computers.

Another power outage, this one only five hours, between midnite and 5AM on Friday. It's pouring again!

Thursday, February 05, 1998

DaveNet: Forgive Her.

Mail Starting 2/5/98.

Tcl spins out of Sun and becomes Scriptics.

New Microsoft scripting releases: server scriptlets, scriptlet wizard, script control for Visual Basic, and script debugger. Windows 95 and NT.

CNN: Senator Hatch warns Microsoft. Says software giant faces heavy regulation if it dominates Internet

Time: How I Survived the Unabomber.

We're working on a direct mail piece. Feedback is appreciated.

Vignette: Ad hoc group forms to study asset-exchange protocols.

NY Times: Karla Tucker is dead, but the debate continues.

The Boston Globe proposes that Netscape reform itself around the Linux operating system. I pretty much agree. In August 1995 I said Netscape needed to combine with a popular operating system. Today I'd go with the Globe and recommend Linux. It's too late to do a deal with Apple, they already have a Microsoft deal.

Philadelphia Daily News: Ted Williams goes to bat for Shoeless Joe Jackson.

Is Netscape for sale? News.com, Wired News.

Some people feel this Perl implementation for Windows is the best one.

A new Apple TV ad. They're selling performance!

With a scripting environment that runs on the fastest G3s (as a native PowerPC app) and the fastest Pentium IIs, we're in a unique position to evaluate the claim. Could we get an independent group together to build and run some benchmarks? We'd be happy to host a mail list and link websites together. This would have the side-benefit of spotting performance bottlenecks in Frontier, which would help us make it faster.

TechWeb: Be is alive and kicking.

Wednesday, February 04, 1998

We got hit by the storm of '98. Man, it was a doozy. Minor flooding, in the server room! The power outage got worse and worse. It came at a not-good time, with lots of sites pointing here after the Frontier 5 ship. We're back on the air now. Think good thoughts. Another storm is coming thru tonight. Pray to The Electricity God!

With respect for my friends who favor the death penalty, let's say a prayer today for the spirit of Karla Faye Tucker. She taught us a lot in her short life.

According to Apple's PR firm, they have new ads airing on the ABC network this evening.

GTML: An HTML pre-processor for Unix and Windows.

PERL for Win32.

News.com: IBM challenges BackOffice.

TidBITS: Frontier 5.0 Ships. Also an update on the O'Reilly book by Matt Neuburg.

MacWEEK: Frontier 5.0 Ships.

A very nice Rhapsody site, done with Frontier.

Monday, February 02, 1998

Every Monday, a totally great site in Thea's Galleria.

Dan Shafer: The end of markup languages.

Mail Starting 2/2/98.

Comments on Cathedrals and Bazaars.

Evangelism: Scripters & Outliners.

News.com: Socialist software.

Frontier is at the top of the list at Windows95.com.

And! We're the cool tool of the week at Webintosh! "The world's most powerful content management system goes cross-platform in its newest release, while UserLand continues to prove that power doesn't have to come at a price." Thanks!

Seattle Times: The Internet in the rural Olympic Peninsula.

Jeff Veen, the WebMonkey man, says Opera is the VW Bug of web browsers.

Patrick Gaumond recommends reading The Little Prince.

Apple lists server-side software for Mac OS. For completenes, we should mention that Frontier does TCP scripting at all levels, including as a great CGI environment/database for Mac web servers.

Lawrence Rozier: Links to outliners.

CNN: Tucker loses clemency bid.

InfoWorld: IBM talks about XML.

XML FAQ.

SunWorld: What's the point of XML?

Sunday, February 01, 1998

Top Frontier 5 Problems -- accumulated wisdom from various UserLand-hosted mail lists.

Are you a Frontier newbie? Great! Ask your questions on the Frontier-newbies list. No question is too basic on this list.

What's going on here?

Daniel Salber's ScriptBits site. "Software updates for the scripting community. No gossip, no comments, no rumors, just the goodies!"

I've seen a RFC that suggests how to assign TCP/IP ports. For example, port 80 is the usual port for HTTP. Question: Does anyone have a pointer to the RFC?

Answer: IANA takes care of this. Here's the spec for port numbers. I needed this info in putting together a cribsheet for setting up Frontier 5 as a HTTP server.

Check this out -- IANA also has a CGI that allows you to register new ports. Wow.

PS: RFC stands for Request For Comment. The Internet is at least partially defined by this collection of documents. It's a very polite thing. I have an idea. Do you have any comments? After a while, the comments stop, and the RFC doc becomes the way everyone does it. It's one of the coolest things about the Internet.

Random note: I wish Windows had Geneva 12 and 9!

Dreams come true, sometimes.

SJ Merc: Programming on a 38-foot boat.

Back issues...

Check out Scripting News -- January 1998.


This page was last built on 3/1/98; 6:56:49 AM by Dave Winer. dave@scripting.com